DAMN LIB!

[Bubba]

Can't deal with the TRUTH?

Movin' threads you can't deal with is low, even for you.

http://www.ariannaonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33842

[Insurrectionchemistry]

Lib has been progressively getting way out of line. He has engaged in disgusting methods, and it appears he cannot moderate because he gets too involved in attempting to suppress discussions.

It appears someone said something to him about all this projection vomit photos that only some juvenile would post. He has stopped that highly disgusting and offensive stuff. Lib does not speak well for Arianna's Online free speech.

Moving the threads around appears to be some passive aggressive measure to support Lib's pro-Zionist games by getting that off the main discussion of current events. If the discussion of the Neo-Cons and their games for wars and economic conquest is not a Current Event, then nothing else there is either.


Lib appears to be abusing his power.

Lib needs to allow people to talk about the issues and stop moving things around and even interfering with putting notes on Current Events that tell where the discussion was moved.


Others object:

http://ariannaonline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=428805#post428805

"I do not personally know Lib and although we are both liberals, his attitude toward WMM on the "Current Events" area shows a lack of professionalism on his part. I do not respect him for his jumping in with his comments on anti-semitism. He's been a trouble maker on the 911 thread"



Lib has an obvious agenda to promote Zionism and those that have supremist intentions, using religion factors that are not too different than Hitler's.

People need to be free to read, discuss, and decide for themselves where the truth lies. They should not be harassed by an overly aggressive moderator, who attempts to sway discussion.


A moderator that gets so involved as to label people, name call, and post disgusting photos has lost the qualities for moderation.


If Lib disagrees with something said, then just state so and perhaps why. Give the counter reasoning. Thats all.

[Lib]

Would you like this thread moved to Off Topic or Israel/Palestine?

[mickey]

The offensive photos should be posted in an offensive photo section so we wouldn't be subjected to them without advance notice. That's my opinion.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

I do think this thread is right where it needs to be, as it is a Current Event.


Is there some problem with Free Speech on AO?

[Biederman]

IIs there some problem with Free Speech on AO?
Yes, there is. It looks like this: http://www.ariannaonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3547

The Mods have established themselves as Judge/Jury/Executioner, an unacceptable condition that you have chosen to accept. You wanna talk here, you talk according to their rules.

Lib is a level-headed Friendly Fascist, and you're a vile anti-semite. Good thing this isn't a popularity contest.

ps Bubba, you're a vile anti-semite too.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

Look in the mirror and see someone with supremicist political beliefs.

It is really that easy to recognize anti-Semites.

They are the ones that only define Semites as Zionist Israel. They don't recognize the nationalism problems in the Torah that cause extreme problems in wars of religion.

They are the ones that don't fairly speak to Arabs as being a Semetic people. They support a nationalistic state based on religion concepts in the Torah that have long promoted wars for land and economic control.

They are the ones that don't like Jesus words for equality of all peoples and his reformation words on the Torah. They are the ones that attempt to make Semetic person Jesus into an anti-semetic slur. They typically attempt to shut down Jesus, and take away Freedom of Religion. They also attempt to take away Freedom of Speech using the same slurs.

The true anti-Semetics are those like Lib and yourself that get up in arms when more than Israel's issues are spoken about. Or when people read both sides of issues. Or list both sides of a point.

Or when they read the actions of the Zionist biased Neo-Cons and ask questions there on the GOP games for control of the US.


Freedom of religion is about believing in elements of religion that one choses based on life's experiences. It isn't about being dictated by the slur word games of Lib and yourself.

It isn't about jumping all over persons like WMM for telling of his religion's beliefs and differing opinions of varied Jewish factions. Freedom of Speech is about defending peoples right to state their positions. That is what the US was founded to protect. It was not founded to have a Hitler like shout down against persons like WMM, who really are engaging in a Constitutionally protected speech right.

Anti-Semites are persons like Lib and yourself that jump up and down when a Semetic person like WMM wants to discuss the merits of the Neo-Con using Protocol type methods for expansion of economic control, rather than really rescuing people that really did not want the US there. They, in fact, are now asking how soon can the US leave and get the area back to normalization.

Religions were made to be checked, inspected, tested, and doing that with the politics of Zionism makes for problems with those of political bias.


Persons like Lib need to decide that they can't serve two masters. Lib can either be a moderator and be unbiased in discussions, Or he can take sides and give the definite appearance that he tries varied games to shut down discussions that don't support his political bias. In the latter case, he needs to end being a moderator. He can't be both.


Just because you and Lib only support Zionism does not make everyone else that speaks of the other Semitic peoples issues as anti-semetic. You are abusing people with slur games.


Truth seeking is about reading all the information and deciding for oneself where the truth or middle ground lies. Truth seeking is best done without those that seek to politicize discussions and attempt to prevent reading the varied source materials.


When people attempt to prevent reading and searching the issues, one has to suspect they are up to no good.


Neither yours nor Libs violations of people's right to Free Speech is appreciated, nor you slurs to attempt to suppress such discussions.


You and Lib attempt to turn AO into a Hitler type shout down process to enforce your poltical bias and beliefs on everyone else. The US went to war against Britain over such issues.


AO moderators should be setting up a friendly place to talk of varied opinions, the real AO system being set up by Lib and yourself is about attempting to intimidate, make persons sick with vomit photos, and every nasty tactic in the book. That is not moderation.

Lib is abusing his power as a moderator in collecting up persons that attempt to attack folks for expressing their opinions on AO. Moderators generally have to support neither side, else they collect a biased following and easliy abuse their power leading to attacks on Free Speech and Freedom of Religon discussions.

[gr8dane]

The Israeli-Palestinian problem was intentionally created for the military industrialists. The whole middle-east has been "the great game" for all of the twentieth century up to the present day.
Nationalism has become the playground for the multi-nationals.

[Lib]

No one has a right to free speech on AO. No one. It is a private forum subject to the owner's control.

Anyone who can't accept this should leave.

[gr8dane]

Word...straight from the level-headed friendly fascist.
Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

Very true. I agree.

WMM recently listing some of the war crimes of Sharone. Israel is about gaining land rights in the Middle East and rights to a religion belief system that easily puts up a system for nationalism. Sharone ended up killing all kinds of Arabs in varied attacks, which are now being called War Crimes.

Hitler did the very same thing. Hitler had his "Fatherland," the Zionists have the Torah's Lands given to Zionists. Hitler had his "Master Race," and the Zionists nationalism has the Chosen People who are considered by Zionists as being better than all others. Hitler tired to become the Father, and the Zionists have their Master Race.

Hitler's natonalism words were used to make wars over money, control, and religion. Zionism's nationalism words resulted in Arabs being consider animals and dumped in concentration camps, which Sharon shot up and worse.

Is there really any difference between the extremes of Zionism and NAZIism, as their words of we are better than all others only have lead to wars and war crimes.


Hence, making the prophetic words of another Semetic person named Jesus all the more prophetic as a lasting fix of the problems. Jesus said all are equal, and the US tries to emphasize equality.

Those that don't act for equality are basically anti-American. As well as anti-Jesus, anti-peace, and anti-common sense.


Those that promote nationalism too stongly promote causes for war, and the Bush and big bankers are into this game.

[Bertrand]

It is very easy to recognize anti-Semites.

They are the ones that only define Semites as Zionist Israel.

They are the ones that don't fairly speak to Arabs as being a Semetic people.

They are the ones that don't like Jesus words for equality of all peoples and his reformation words on the Torah.

The true anti-Semetics are those like Lib and yourself that get up in arms when more than Israel's issues are spoken about. Or when people read both sides of issues.

Or when they read the actions of the Zionist biased Neo-Cons and ask questions there.


Freedom of religion is about believing in elements of religion that one choses based on lifes experiences. It isn't about being dictated by the word games of Lib and yourself.

It isn't about jumping all over persons like WMM for telling of his religion's beliefs and differing opinions of varied Jewish factions.

Anti-Semites are persons like Lib and yourself that jump up and down when a Semetic person like WMM wants to discuss the merits of the Neo-Con using Protocol type methods for expansion of economic control, rather than really rescuing people that really did not want the US there. They, in fact, as asking how soon can the US leave and get the area back to normalization.

Religions were made to be checked, inspected, tested, and doing that with the politics of Zionism makes for problems with those of political bias.


Persons like Lib need to decide that they can't serve two masters. Lib can either be a moderator and be unbiased in discussions, Or he can take sides and give the definite appearance that he tries varied games to shut down discussions that don't support his political bias.


Just because you and Lib only support Zionism does not make everyone else that speaks of the other Semitic peoples issues as anti-semetic.


Truth seeking is about reading all the information and deciding for oneself where the truth or middle ground lies. Truth seeking is best done without those that seek to politicize discussions and attempt to prevent reading the veried source materials.


When people attempt to prevent reading and searching the issues, one has to suspect they are up to no good.

Congrats for a good post.

I agree with most of what you said with notable exceptions.

As I don't have much time, let me try to make few points clearer, if possible.

I don't find defending the safety of Israelis wrong. We owe that to every human being on this planet.

The fact is that... few are confused with the word Zionist.

And, apparently few among them are knowingly or unknowingly accepting and even approving of the Zionist radicals' adopted Nazi-like strategies and tactics to steal lands and commit modern genocide... using the Zionists among them in a different manner. To some Zionist means a Jew. That is not what I mean when I speak of a Zionist but the ones like Zionist radicals... zealots, whom we already KNOW by their BEHAVIOR, ACTS and DEEDS.

Those confused about the word Zionist and Zionist radicals who APPROVE of the radicals KNOWN and PROVEN reprehensible behavior and deeds... are equally dangerous and ugly characters like the Zionist radicals.

Those who are ignorant and unable to understand, for whatever reasons (ignorant, lack of intelligence, just because they happen to be Jews, uninformed, lack of comprehension, etc.) and shut the dialogue because of it... are ignorant ENABLERS in America.

Then there is that class like Libs, Dingos, etc... on top of their ignorance are too eager to hurl the anti-Jew, anti-Semitic labels that only they tip their hand... of who THEY REALLY are.

Thanks for your contributions, IC. But keep in mind that not any ONE holy books and NO any ONE organized religion... has a PATENT on the truth. Actually all are old antiquated DOGMA mostly... with few good concepts here and there. All manmade and little or nothing to do with the CREATOR who made the universe, our world, and all the physical laws applicable equally to us all.

Gratuitous hurling of labels only reveals one's own level of understanding. It makes one's own statement at best.

So much for this time.

Peace.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

So, is Lib now speaking for Arianna?

Who owns the Forum and just what is her position on Zionism and Free Speech.

What are Arianna's beliefs. What did she give you as an outline for moderation and goals for the Forum.

Should she be allowed to tell those herself? Is Arianna about promoting Zionism, allowing a moderator to post disgusting vomit photos. Does this reflect badly upon her Forum's management.

Perhaps you need to go ask her for her comments, and don't take things out of context or taint them.


In particular, take all those disgusting vomit photos and print them out and lay them on all of Arianna's office staff, her board, and Arianna herselfs own incoming desk mailbox and see what they say.

Then lay down the question on why you did that type response. It has the appearance of something that juvenile kids do to attempt to cause the other to throw up. Which, for a moderator doing such, has the look of him attempting to keep people from bringing up that discussion because such disgusting photos make them sick.

Then ask Arianna and the rest of the office how people on the Forum can expect to have the moderator doing such extremes is to be called on the carpet for doing such. Moderators that get that involved, so overrought, just can't moderate themselves.

My guess is, if they see those vomit photos in the office setting as your response to any of them, they'll tell you to hit the street.


Then tell all of Arianna's in your moderator role that you did that to support this offer of AO:

"Have something to say? Want to debate politics, social issues? Well, here's your chance. All you need is an opinion and a keyboard. So join Arianna and other guests in a lively, ongoing, and non-obscenity laced debate of the issues."

[gr8dane]

I agree with Lib that the "Israel" problem deserves its own forum.
It's a subject that isn't to be ignored.

[Gerry]

No one has a right to free speech on AO. No one. It is a private forum subject to the owner's control.

Anyone who can't accept this should leave.

Bullshit......This forum site is provided for debate....It does NOT stipulate that certain topics are off limits. The Israeli/Palestinian issue is a current events issue..... YOU are not the owner, the question was put to you WHY you moved a current event of this forum and placed it on another one. Who gave you that authority. If you tell me its' the owner, I will contact the owner and request clarification.

[Bertrand]

I agree with Lib that the "Israel" problem deserves its own forum.
It's a subject that isn't to be ignored.

I too agree with you and Lib.

This question is the most important and urgent one for America and us as citizens in a nation when administration after administration of both parties have let the few decide for the many... leading us as a nation to the brink of world disaster... with unwise and unjust policies, politics and acts.

We need to look into these problems, learn the lessons, and seek to establish justice, equality and mutual respect with other nations very soon... before we continue in this path of not only self destruction... but that of the entire world!

We need to learn and educate each others to become better informed first and SEE TO IT that JUSTICE is done regardless of race, religion, ethnicity, color, culture, etc... and preventing the ignorant, the zealot, and the greedy lead us to our destruction!

We owe this to ourselves, and every other decent human being wherever they may be on this planet, and to future generations.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

Well, if this is a subject not to be discouraged, then the moderator needs to bring up the idea on the thread of moving the subject into a special zone. Even ask for objections. Else moving the subject from the mainstream discussion zone that everyone reads tends to suggest the idea was not one of making the subject more prominent.

Instead the thread just disappeared off Current Events, with no notice or anything.

Even when I listed that the Discussion was moved by the moderator to a special zone, that was moved. So, I put that information into many other related discussions to overcome the censorship game of moving the topic off the main discussion forum.

Only after several very public complaints about the Neo-Con / Protocols thread being moved did the moderator make a note on the Current Events as to the New Zone.


The timeline of Lib's Actions speak loudly, and the actions demonstrate someone that decided to attempt to make readers sick with disgusting suggestive vomit photos, then to retaliate by hiding the discussion into areas folks don't normally read each day, then come up with excuses to attempt to hide it.

[Biederman]

Just because you and Lib only support Zionism does not make everyone else that speaks of the other Semitic peoples issues as anti-semetic. You are abusing people with slur games.
Israel is a flawed state and guilty of crimes against humanity including torture and collective punishment - just like the US and a lot of her Cold War allies. Unconditional support of Israel is a beam in the eye of US policymakers. You are an antisemite. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism

Blather on, I won't be responding - I don't post here, the Mods are Fascists.

[Lib]

I don't post here, the Mods are Fascists.
This is untrue on its face and takes hyperbole to a new high. Make that a new low.

Biederman means me yet all I do is hamper some few of the severest forms of abusing our host's generosity. That is not fascism it is good manners albeit barely. I regret it is too much for some for I have often been instructed to good avail by this bright man.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

It is time for Lib to tell who owns AO. Then to explain why AO does not believe in free speech.
Lib needs to tell why Arianna does not approve of free speech on her forum.

Lib also needs to pass around his vomit photos to Arianna and see that any disapproval of free speech likely applies only this LIB's extreme degeneracy with such vile photos intended to prevent free speech discussions.

So, where are the Forum's owners thoughts on having such a juvenile moderator who is the one pushing the limits on free speech, who avoids truth like a plague.

====

Let us get this anti-semitism slur exposed for what it is. Jesus is well established for taking up differences with the Torah, and is even recorded in the Jewish Talmuds as having done so.

Today, the differences of Jesus with the Torah are ill defined as anti-Semetic. This slur is applied by persons like Biederman would apply the same to all those who believe in Jesus, which is a large part of the US.

Like Jesus, I have objections to many of the human induced words of the Torah and don't buy them. Certain parts of Torah I reject and call dangerous and nationalistic. I call being able to do this Freedom of Religion.

I agree with Jesus on many parts and even the problems prophecized in Revelations. I see Jesus as a person who attempted to reform the bad concepts in the Torah / Old Testament with his words captured in the New Testament.

Jesus was a Semetic person (Middle Eastern Aramaic speaking) and of Jewish religion orientation, and he was killed for causing too many issues in public on the problems of the Pharisee and Torah. Recall that the Pharisee said that Jesus reject their Torah law, and he should be crucified for breaking their religious law. This religion concept was forced into the Roman's Govt. as the reason to have Jesus killed.

So, what does one see. That when there is failure to separated church and state, comes bloodshed for no good reason. Torah is a religious belief that has lots of problems. Govt. cannot operate based upon continuance of these problems, so Govt. has to use truth, not religion to Govern.

Similarly, the Islams issues rise up in similar complaints as we see factors like religion attempt to control the US Govt. When the false concepts of the Torah are included in matters of state with Israel, or with evangelists that don't recognize Jesus' complaints against Torah. Then we get back into Holy Wars and more bloodshed. Big bankers and the Mil/Ind. Network all know the game.


Generally those that pick up this illdefined and intended word anti-semtic like to use it to bankrupt the US to keep Israel safe. The US simply cannot affort to keep Israel safe as long as it sticks to these bad concepts in the Torah. It is fiscally irresponsible and will pull down the US Govt. Lots of the Jewish people don't support Zionism and get along just fine in other countries. So, why should the US bankrupt itself to keep Pharisee like political extremes forced into Govt. safe.

Obvious to most, the Govt. has to return to decision making based in simple truths, not those of problems induced from religious narratives. Some of this reformation is happening by kicking the words like In God We Trust off the Money and the Commandments Out of the Court houses.

Some of the reform needs to happen by correctly defining what Semetic means, and include the Arabs and Jesus as a Semetic people. And calling those that attempt to define Semetic as only a Jewish thing as the real anti-Semetics for failure to use the definition properly. The term Semetic refers to more than Jews and all those that attempt to exclude the Arab rights and Jesus complaints are more correctly the anti-Semite.

Those who try to define Jews as the only Semetic peoples are the ones the Arabs tend to call the Satans, or in Hebrew the term Satan means the opposition. Satans are in opposition to truths, and pull in the Pharisee extremes of religion being the law and force into Govt. control.


It is persons like Biederman who are the Great Satans, who attempt to define all around one single faction of the Middle East. It is persons similar to him in Govt., the Bush Dynasty, who attempt to suppress the real complaints of Jesus on the Torah's bad concepts that now drive this faked up war on Iraq.


The real picture says Biederman, Lib, and others are really in Satan's bed together. Lib is not a true Liberal, he is a camp followerer of Bush's religion treachery using faked up definitions that support causes for faked up Bush wars. Biederman, Lib, and etc. are those that are of the ilk of Satan.


Their poor abilties to see past the smoke screen of ill defined slurs and diatribes are what really sustains these Holy Wars. They willing jump into the Bush Skull's coffin for Born Again profits from Theology.


Me, I just have the greatest appreciation of the insights of Jesus and what he attempted to present. Most of the US is supposed to share this appreciation for Jesus, but fail to get things right due to the smoke screen of ill defined words and slurs to attempt to keep them from the truth.

So, as the Govt. sanitizes itself from all these separation of church and state problems we can get down to the simple logic that all people need to be equal. False concepts from religion narratives don't need to run the country, nor the faked up defintions that try to revolve around only one relgion.

As this cleansing of the Govt. of religion happens, the US will become less of a Great Satan and won't be manipulated by those who want to fashion those religion untruths into great wars for wealth and control.

Biederman is obviously one of these persons who wants to sustain wars with concepts that only those with tiny minds can buy into. Biederman is of the tiny mind ilk of the GOP that wants these wars based upon the Theological lies of Bush and Zionism.

Since Biederman opposes these simple truths on what is going on, he is closer to Satan than that of the concept for God and all being equal that Jesus proposed.

Me, I stand behind Jesus' better concepts. I stand behind the more correct definitions that represent all equally. I reject the concepts of the Satans and always seek the simple truths.

Biederman's GOP buy-in obviously does none of this simple logic, and prefers war to peace.

Biederman and Lib are Bush Theologians. Satans.

=========

[Insurrectionchemistry]

Some of the definitions that show up Lib and Biederman types for what they are---Bush theology supporters.

They are Bush theologians, who attempt to suppress the truths presented by Semtic persons like Jesus. Theologians that subscribe to the issues of Satan, who suppress exposing the problems in the Torah.

Jesus spoke to problems in Torah and so did the latter occuring Islam, who likely paid attention to Jesus's complaints on Pharisee extremes. It is those that suppress these associations of varied factions speaking to problems in Torah and forcing these factors into Govt. that are the war mongers.

Islam recognizes Jesus and even Mose as profits, but they don't recognize the Pharisee's presentations of these profits, nor do they recognize the Bush theology that distorts and supresses Jesus message. Jesus called these Pharisee as Satans. Islam does essentially the same.

Those who attempt to avoid these associations and deal with the real problmes and real histories are the theologians for war.

====

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism

Anti-Judaism in the New Testament
Christian theology rooted in Roman Catholic theology was stimulated by the traditional reading of the New Testament, resulting in 'replacement theology' (or supersessionism), which taught that with the coming of Jesus a new covenant has rendered obsolete and has superseded the religion of Judaism. It was believed that the Jews, as a people, were responsible for the death of Jesus, and a number of early and influential Church works -- such as the dialogues of Justin Martyr, the homilies of John Chrysostom, and the testimonies of church father Cyprian -- are strongly anti-Jewish.

There are a number of passages in the New Testament that some see as anti-Semitic, or have been used for anti-Semitic purposes, most notably:

Jesus speaking to a group of Pharisees: "You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has nothing to do with the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies. But, because I tell the truth, you do not believe me. Which of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? He who is of God hears the words of God; the reason why you do not hear them is you are not of God." (John 8:44-47, RSV)
Stephen speaking before a synagogue council: "You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. Which of the prophets did not your fathers persecute? And they killed those who announced beforehand the coming of the Righteous One, whom you have now betrayed and murdered, you who received the law as delivered by angels and did not keep it." (Acts 7:51-53, RSV)
"Behold, I will make those of the synagogue of Satan who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie -- behold, I will make them come and bow down before your feet, and learn that I have loved you." (Revelation 3:9, RSV).
Some biblical scholars hold that verses like these reflect the Jewish-Christian tensions that were emerging in the late first or early second century, and do not originate with Jesus. Today, the major Christian denominations de-emphasize verses such as these, and reject their use by anti-Semites.

====

Anti-Semitism within Islam is discussed in the article on Islam and anti-Semitism. Anti-Semitism in the Arab World is discussed in the article on Arabs and anti-Semitism

The Qur'an, Islam's holy book, accuses the Jews of corrupting the Hebrew Bible. Muslims refer to Jews and Christians as a "People of the book"; Islamic law demands that when under Muslim rule they should be tolerated as dhimmis - from the Arab term ahl adh-dhimma. The writer Bat Ye'or introduced the modern word Dhimmitude as a generic indication of this Islamic attitude. Dhimmis were granted protection of life (even against other muslim states), wealth and honor, the right to residence, worship, and work or trade, and were exempted from military service, the zakah tax, and Muslim religious duties and personal law. They were obligated to pay other taxes (jizyah and land tax), and subject to various other restrictions regarding blaspheming Islam, the Qur'an or Muhammad, proselytizing, and at times a number of other restrictions on dress, riding horses or camels, carrying arms, holding public office, building places of worship higher than mosques, mourning loudly, wearing shoes outside the mellah, etc.

Anti-Semitism in the Muslim world increased in the twentieth century, as anti-Semitic motives and blood libels were imported from Europe and as resentment against Zionist efforts in British Mandate of Palestine spread. While anti-Semitism has certainly been heightened by the Arab-Israeli conflict, there were an increasing number of pogroms against Jews even before the foundation of Israel, including Nazi-inspired pogroms in Algeria in the 1930s, and massive attacks on the Jews in Iraq and Libya in the 1940s (see Farhud). George Gruen attributes the increased animosity towards Jews in the Arab world to several factors including: The breakdown of the Ottoman Empire and traditional Islamic society; domination by Western colonial powers under which Jews gained a disproportionatly large role in the commercial, professional, and administrative life of the region; the rise of Arab nationalism, whose proponents sought the wealth and positions of local Jews through government channels; resentment over Jewish nationalism and the Zionist movement; and the readiness of unpopular regimes to scapegoat local Jews for political purposes.[7]

Anti-Zionist propaganda in the Middle East frequently adopts the terminology and symbols of the Holocaust to demonize Israel and its leaders. At the same time, Holocaust denial and Holocaust minimization efforts have found increasingly overt acceptance as sanctioned historical discourse in a number of Middle Eastern countries.

[Bertrand]

The Mods have established themselves as Judge/Jury/Executioner, an unacceptable condition that you have chosen to accept. You wanna talk here, you talk according to their rules.

RIGHT on "The Mods established themselves as Judge/Jury/Executioner, and unacceptable condition that you have chosen to accept."

WRONG on "You wanna talk here, you talk according to their rules." Lib has demonstrated his incompetence, ineptness and immaturity and lack of presence to apply the rules.

Lib is a level-headed Friendly Fascist, and you're a vile anti-semite. Good thing this isn't a popularity contest.

You are way over the mark with that remark of Lib.

Lib comes across more like an ENABLER... of the larger policies of the U.S... while being critical with the Bush regime... Such people are legion in America... and they are the herd (ENABLERS) for them to let their government (the minority) to decide... and the results are now finally are becoming apparent- America in serious crisis at home and internationally.

No time in America's history, has America become as hated... around the world as it is today.

In a shrinking world of increasing wmds in the hands of smaller nations and even zealot groups, being passionately hated (jihadists, religious zealotry on both sides) by billions of people around the world... is bad news... especially when that is also partly based on injustices done to them... by successive deeds of American administrations of the past... and thepresent Bush regime invasion to trigger the widening religious war.

[Insurrectionchemistry]

More:

As these matters apply to Bush and the White House, it seems relevant to get into some of the Nixon tapes on discussions with Evanglist Billy Graham. Graham told Bush that the Jews would ruin the US, if they gained too much influence. Nixon is famous for noteing how so many in the upper halls of US Govt. were "Jew Boys," in his own words.

As presidents come and go, most of the lower levels stay in place and those with money and influnce install more people that run Govt. by their influence. Over the decades, the "Jew Boys" in Govt. have increased in number.

Most of the "Jew Boys" these days are the so called "Neo-Cons," and they are not the Orthodox type Jews, but more Zionist oriented Jews. So, now we have lots of Zionist Jews like Wolfowitz and others writing up their PNAC plans and all kinds of things. Most of the Jewish all subscribe to the Torah being their law. It becomes a state within a state issue, where the logic of separation of church and state is torn down. Which means the Jesus ideals get run over, and Zionism and Pharisee problems of religion are forced into the US Govt.


This is the root of the Bush theology problems. Bush likes making the Mil/ Ind network, the Carlyle Weapons industries, and the Fed. Res. bankers rich and the American People looted of their wealth. They want the American People stipped of their power, and replaced with an oligarchy that feeds on money and bankrupts the US with national debts.


Bush does all the Zionist Jewish types want, and this makes their oligarchy richer. It expands their empire goals to take more of a footprint in the Middle East, their black Texas tea / black gold.


The problem then becomes quite obvious that those of the Pharisee problems on religion have taken over the US Govt., and they want to toss out the Jesus concepts. Bush's Theology is designed to court wars for profits and use these Pharisee concepts to facilitate them.


Jesus concepts are about peace, which does not fit the Bush and get richer banking plan. Plus, Jesus and the Islam issues tend to agree too much, which if recognized would result in the ejection of the Pharasee war games from the US Govt. So, we have the issues of the anti-Christ and Christ as the dichotomy in the US Govt. It makes Bush and his oligarchy for wars into the anti-Christ. All of it based upon lies and very big and growing lies.


Repeating history, Some of it gets back to like problems of Germany in the 30s, when the Germans noted that lots of the Pharasee Torah law types were in high places of the German Govt., and they too were going bankrupt. So, Germany decided to kick Jews out of Govt. Jews in New York declaired war on Hitler. And one huge war about who gets all the money was the result. All of it originating from these flaws in religion concepts.

Same basic repeat of history is happening today.

Bush is the anti-Christ, because Bush is all about Pharissee concepts and Zionism and nothing about Jesus and Jesus' presentation of the problems to come from Pharisee religion being part of Govt. Now the war mongers want to remove all Jesus ideals and try to make Jesus an anti-Semite. Jesus was about peace and not useful for the Bush Oligarchy. Recognizing Jesus truths as being higher puts an end to the Pharisee Jews law, and forces peace and Christian ideals into the forefront. Bush, the anti-Christ, does not want that---it puts an end to faked up reasons for war for Israel between the Islam differences.

The real issue is Jesus made valid observations based upon his exposures to the Egyptian Mystery Schools, the same theology on nature's order that also taught Moses. Jesus was called a "magician" for knowing these same concepts that Moses was taught. Jesus was put to death for wanting to make these problems public and violating what these Pharisees termed as their law.


Such flawed principles of religon from the Torah does not need to steer the US Govt., nor be consided its laws. And those that use slur words to attempt to dismiss the real history of problems in religion are not at all interested in truth seeking.

Or bringing on a time for peace, as they consider it unprofitable.

Those that steer for the power of money and profits don't want peace and don't respect the teachings of Jesus. They impugn the dignity and memory of the dead who believe in Jesus and Jesus himself.