Overview of "Groups" idea...

[admin]

Let me explain what I mean by groups a little more.

One of the suggestions that came in when we asked for suggestions on how to improve the AriannaOnline forum was to allow people to have separate areas of the forum that they could mingle with others of like mind. At first I wasn't sure if we wanted to split up the discussions, but then after reflecting on the value of that idea, I thought that this would be a perfect way to use the group functions of this forum software.

My first though was to do something among political party lines, but then I realized that there were so many political parties out there, and I didn't want to exclude any one of them arbitrarily, I came up with "liberal," "conservative," and "moderate" groups.

The idea would be that anyone that wants to be assigned to a "group" would have to pick one of these predefined groups. Once a member of a group, you will be allow to participate in that groups forum. The groups will also be assigned moderators from within the group membership.

So, before I take on this new plan, I wanted to get some feedback from everyone.

-r

[kehvan]

Let me explain what I mean by groups a little more.

One of the suggestions that came in when we asked for suggestions on how to improve the AriannaOnline forum was to allow people to have separate areas of the forum that they could mingle with others of like mind. At first I wasn't sure if we wanted to split up the discussions, but then after reflecting on the value of that idea, I thought that this would be a perfect way to use the group functions of this forum software.

My first though was to do something among political party lines, but then I realized that there were so many political parties out there, and I didn't want to exclude any one of them arbitrarily, I came up with "liberal," "conservative," and "moderate" groups.

The idea would be that anyone that wants to be assigned to a "group" would have to pick one of these predefined groups. Once a member of a group, you will be allow to participate in that groups forum. The groups will also be assigned moderators from within the group membership.

So, before I take on this new plan, I wanted to get some feedback from everyone.

-r
Of course I think this is a great idea, but if I may, I'd like to make a few suggestions on groups.

I'm thinking 4 groups... social lib-fiscal lib
From a republican point of view, this is the typical liberal democrat. The embodiment of this category is someone like the late Paul Wellstone. social con-fiscal lib
This is an atypical democrat who wouldn't side with the democrats on the issue of gays or women in the military, but would readily find common ground with other democrats on the issue of government regulation. This category is probably best represented with the likes of Robert Byrd. social lib-fiscal con
This is an atypical republican and most often a north eastern republican. These republicans are usually in favor of letting women chose on abortion and favor other relaxed standards on social issue, but are generally tight with the purse strings. Olympia Snowe best embodies this category. social con-fiscal con
This is your typical republican for the democrat point of view. The republican that probably best represents this category is someone like Newt Gingrich.
Many people may want to use that "Political Compass" that's been going around, but the language used to describe the groups doesn't seem that accurate. Besides, saying that 'authoritarian' is a political group seems a bit silly and not accurately descriptive of the wide variety within any part of the spectrum. In other words, there are social and fiscal liberals that would be just as willing to enforce their concept of good government and good citizenship on everyone as much as a social and fiscal conservative would be willing to do the same; and even for being on opposite ends of the spectrum, each would be authoritarian in their own way.

[admin]

Good start... anyone else have some feedback?

-r

[Woody]

I am not sure about splitting up. I like the idea of "mixing it up" and being able to learn from both sides.

[Alexx]

Is Software defining function?

gasp.

It sounds like inbreeding to me.

Although you have come up with the next Survivor theme.
8 democrats pitted against 8 republicans.

[kehvan]

I am not sure about splitting up. I like the idea of "mixing it up" and being able to learn from both sides.
You're missing the point Woody. There would still be open discussion areas where everyone can freely communicate. The difference is you'd have additional discussion areas that are segmented by political identity.

[Woody]

Thanks for the clarification. As long as we have a general area also.

[kehvan]

Thanks for the clarification. As long as we have a general area also.
We'd have to have that. There'd be no point if we didn't have that.

[Bertrand]

Not a good idea, in my opinion, when it comes to people in general and to posters at this forum.

Labels or classifications tend to pigeonhole people on the intellectual level and is a simplification of the more complex human dynamic... for linguistic(?) convenience.

Most open minded rational thinkers would not want to be labeled or classified as they tend to be aware that they are on a path of (lifelong) learning and evolving. Learning and enlightment comes often from the clash of contrasting ideas.

[Peter Angelo]

I was going to write to you and thank you for having the best website of this kind in the universe. My hats off to Arianna.

A separate room for groups that hate to think might be good. It will keep them off of the general board and spare us the narrow minded.

This forum is the most incredible teaching and learning tool for a writer that ever existed. The Internet allows research capabilities I could not have dreamed of in the 60's when I first went to college.

The free flow if conversation exactly the way it is now is perfect. Division is the problem terrorizing the world forever. What can be learned by preaching to the choir?

In a writing course at USF in 1995, I switched papers with the student next to me to critique. It was a class exercise. The young person whose paper I read was semi-literate at best. After class I told the professor my seventh grade English teacher would have torn that paper up and thrown it in my face. Here we are in a major university and an English major can't write. What's up?

He told me that he gets pressure from the administration to keep that seat full, no matter what.

I have a degree in mass communications from USF. I have taken every writing course possible for fifty years. A mass com degree is essentially an English degree with a specialization.

I have been tempted to ask some of this forum's users if they would like me to edit their writing and show them how it should be written and why. I suggest buying, "The Little Brown Book", from your local university bookstore. It is the bible of the English language.

This forum inspires me to think, research, and write. Inspiration is the hardest thing for a writer to have. This forum is a goldmine and a working tool.

I have an idea for a book based on this forum and would like to discuss copyright issues. My brother is an attorney. I'm covered.

Please keep this site going. I tell everyone I can what a treasure it is.

Thank Arianna from the bottom of my heart. She is an Archangel.

[Fred]

Generally I think it is a good idea. The classification process will prove difficult because some may balk at the categories to choose from. I would probably want to leave it at conservative, moderate and liberal, but there are many gradations within those cats. Then again, you have to rely on one person's self evaluation.......that ought to be interesting in itself.
I like the idea. It's all in the detail.

[admin]

Most open minded rational thinkers would not want to be labeled or classified as they tend to be aware that they are on a path of (lifelong) learning and evolving. Learning and enlightment comes often from the clash of contrasting ideas.
Well said.

-r

[Sweet Caroline]

Admin, would each member only be permitted access to one group? Would we be able to read but not post to a group that was not our own? If you decided you didn't like a group, could you change to another? And how is this idea different from AmericasDebate?

Mark me down as one opposed to the idea. I don't like the idea of all those moderators who would likely have access to our private information. Will you give us a chance to be removed from the membership before you turn the place over to moderators? I think I'll change my personal information right now.

[Producer Economics]

You have the groups divided into 4 groups. I would like to suggest the division into three groups. These three groups more closely represent the current political-economic climate in the U.S. today!
The three groups should be: Left Wing Socialists, Right Wing Socialists and those who want pure Democracy.
Definition of Left Wing Socialists: Most people are familiar with this philosophy. It is the use of the government to manage and control the economy. Communism is the ultimate state found here.
Definition of Right Wing Socialists: Right Wing Socialists take control of and use the government to redistribute the wealth of the nation into the hands of the wealthy. They use deficit spending, state sanctioned monoplies and government subsidies to transfer this wealth. Fascism is the ultimate form in this group. Today in America the Republican Party is being run and controlled by the Right Wing Socialists.
The third group is Democracy: This is Democracy as defined in the United States Declaration of Independence "all men are created equal."
This is an unalienable right. This is the basic right of all Americans. It is basic to the Preamble to the Constitution and to the Constitution itself.
This is what is out in America today.
Currently the Republicans are not fiscal conservatives, they are fiscal liberals per the definition meaning excess. I call 7 trillion in deficit spending since 1969 very very excessive and criminal. They have not balanced a federal budget since 1960, that was 43 years ago.
The Democrats are the fiscal conservatives today.

[Kim]

I don't want to spend my time with like-minded people.....you don't learn as much from them.

There are plenty of sites out there that cater specifically to the different ideologies. That's the beauty of this site; it doesn't do that. The added feature to this forum of the private message function was a great addition.

I feel there is already enough of an "us vs them" attitude in this country. Don't be a Bush and divide us here too.

I'm afraid that the "Main" board would die if there were too many places to choose from.

My vote would be to leave it alone.

[Alexx]

I don't want to spend my time with like-minded people.....you don't learn as much from them.


and let me add this one based on my own personal experience.

"I had the worst day of my life today, everywhere I went everyone was like me.".

[Jitoen Le Tur]

Bu$h has already divided the country, and dividing the forum would just be another step in the wrong direction. There really isn't any communication on the forum anyway. People are just standing on their own soap box shouting ideas. What might help is to offer Bu$h supporters an intelligence test, and subsequent mental rehabilitation.

[admin]

I'm reading a lot of good reasons for not creating groups. We'll keep talking about for awhile to give everyone a chance to weigh in.

In the meantime, what does everyone think about the idea of creating a R-Rated and a G-Rated forum?

-r

[Alexx]

I don't like swearing posts, but I wouldn't want to be in a rated G group only.

---------------------------------------

Instead of a groups style of forum, how about a "cause" of the month forum. (in addition, not as a replacement to the regular general forum)

This might be a good way to really go in depth for a certain cause or issue.

Perhaps the first day of the week is for nominating topics. The next day is for voting via poll for the "hottest" two or three topics. Then have the forum devoted to those two or three topics for the rest of the week.

Perhaps the two or three topics could be split amonst conservative based, liberal based, and centrist or liberterian based topics. Maybe every week you add a couple of new hot topics but don't get rid of the old, just archive those instead.

[Kim]

I can think of lots of poster who would LIVE in the R-rated room. However, only one poster comes to mind who would really enjoy the G-rated room................syd.

[Michael Feinberg]

re: R rated and G rated groups.

There are advantages to having a set-aside flame-free group. HOWEVER, it would necessitate more policing if it is to be regarded as something more than simply a group fewer nasty words. This means more policing by the administrator; in other words, more work for you.

My suggestion is this for the G rated group: Let the administrator or some designated person pick out 4-5 unrelated weekly current event topical subjects: for example, something like the BBC does in "Have Your Say": See:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/talking_point/default.stm

In this G-rated forum, the poster does not respond to another poster, but rather, responds directly to a subject posted by the administrator or some editor designated by the administrator.

For example: The administrator picks a buzz topic: "To what or whom is the current economic recovery most indebted, in your opinion, and will it continue?"

[Alexx]

Kim, I love that Samuel Johnson Quote.

[Kim]

Thanks, Alex. I always feel the best way to judge someone is how they treat a food server.

That quote also sums up why I am not a Bush Co fan.

[Gerry]

<<<I'm thinking 4 groups...
social lib-fiscal lib
From a republican point of view, this is the typical liberal democrat. The embodiment of this category is someone like the late Paul Wellstone.
social con-fiscal lib
This is an atypical democrat who wouldn't side with the democrats on the issue of gays or women in the military, but would readily find common ground with other democrats on the issue of government regulation. This category is probably best represented with the likes of Robert Byrd.
social lib-fiscal con
This is an atypical republican and most often a north eastern republican. These republicans are usually in favor of letting women chose on abortion and favor other relaxed standards on social issue, but are generally tight with the purse strings. Olympia Snowe best embodies this category.
social con-fiscal con
This is your typical republican for the democrat point of view. The republican that probably best represents this category is someone like Newt Gingrich.
Kehvan>>>


The craziest thing I ever read. Labels, labels, labels. And absolutes. There is NO such thing. Why in the world would anyone want to go to a board of likeminded people. Who are they anyway? The stepford wives? How the heck is anyone going to learn? And I think very differently today than I did yesterday and I'll be thinking differently tomorrow. So what group does that put me in?

[admin]

I don't like swearing posts, but I wouldn't want to be in a rated G group only.
I wasn't suggesting that the R & G rated forums be groups, but rather secondary forums places for people to interact. What would be really cool is if I could program the system to allow each user to select the level of word filtering for themselves. Hmmm.... me like that idea... me strong programmer... maybe me go off and do later...

Okay we now return you to the regularly scheduled, non-caveman version, of Robb:
As for policing, I think that if we were clear on what the rules were, then we would be okay. The only time I think that we would 'loose' control is if we had another spammer or other trouble-maker trying to interfere with everyone else's enjoyment / use of the forum.

In those cases, we can quickly deactivate their account, and block them from the forum -- much like we did with the first spammer on this new system.

More work for us -- probably -- but it's up to you guys to tell us if it's worth it. :)

-r

[Alexx]

How about this for a filter.

We can choose what percent of the "objectionable" word is filtered.

This way people can kind of know what the word was without actually having to "read it and see it" unless they want to take a moment and figure it out. It's their choice.

Pretend Scrapper is an "objectionable" word.

I choose to have 50% of the letters blocked. So it would show up as S*r*p*e*. If I want to take a moment to figure what the word was, I can, if I don't want to, I can kind of glide over it and only refer to it if it somehow helped make the sentence flow correctly.

Sometimes, when an entire word is covered, people may wonder what the word was, and they may sit there and try to figure it out and become distracted from the actual post.

[Joe Dawson]

social con-fiscal con
This is your typical republican for the democrat point of view. The republican that probably best represents this category is someone like Newt Gingrich.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


Newt Gingrich best represents the social conservative?

Serial adulterer and deadbeat dad?

You said it, Kev.

[Kim]

Trying to exert too much control over this board will take the fun and adventure out of it. You gave us the private message feature. Why not just leave everything as it is?

[cricket]

Robb...I think that it would be great to have a just for fun area where we can discuss everything but politics....

I like the idea of a article disect section.......either people posting a link.....or perhaps a short c and p and then discussion limited to disecting the article.......


It might be neat to have a consitution and bill of rights section....where each threads takes a different part of the consitution, ammendment or bill of rights and we debate and discuss...

I also could see a religious/ philosophy section.....


I like those divisions much more so than divisions based on ideology.

[Jitoen Le Tur]

In a "g" rated forum, you couldn't say, "Bush."

[Buzzbee]

Arianna gave me my intoduction to this wonderous thing that was increasingly mired in nonesense. On the 21st of January I fell into the crew that started hypercrites where I've lived ever since. Today I've joined this newly configured attempt to deal with this cyber critter that will be with humanity forever. And what's the first thing I find? Groups. You don't need no stinking groups. Just get on with the business of trying to figure out where this great land of ours is headed. Thanksgiving is a great day to start.

Buzz

[Peter Angelo]

I hope this posts. Suddenly there is a debug message that comes up everytime I want to post. What's up?

[cricket]

Hi Buzz...I hope that Robb does not do the groups either. Please stop in often. :)

[Sweet Caroline]

Why are we posting duplicate messages?

[Sweet Caroline]

Arianna gave me my intoduction to this wonderous thing that was increasingly mired in nonesense. On the 21st of January I fell into the crew that started hypercrites where I've lived ever since. Today I've joined this newly configured attempt to deal with this cyber critter that will be with humanity forever. And what's the first thing I find? Groups. You don't need no stinking groups. Juist get on with the business of trying to figure out where this great land of ours is headed. Thanksgiving is a great day to start.

Buzz

The advantage of Hypercrites.com forums is that there is no moderation, but no one is allowed to flood the board. The software there is superb. I hope some from this forum will drop by and try it out.
Right now there are few enough active posters that your message doesn't get buried under a deluge of stuff. Here's the link: http://hypercrites.com